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Thread: PvP Ranks Need to Be Reset

  1. #21
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    You guys checked the pvp equipment?

    First set is Rank free Level 60 for just favor, then there is an Rank 60 Armor and an Upgrade of that one so we have an reset with the rank free armor. Problem solved.

    brgds

    CB

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ragnor View Post
    currently the first tier doesnt require any rank to purchase and is relatively cheap but the new players will still have a massive gap and wont be able to purchase the 2nd tier of gear untill after 60 levels
    Stats on new pvp gear seems a bit messy atm but assuming that Spell Power on staffs is correct then it looks like the gear progression is much smoother.

    Currently on Live T0 PvP Staff has 506 SP and T3 PvP Staff has 811 SP. So that is a 305 SP difference. That is a 60 % increase in SP by getting to rank 50.

    On Test a T0 60 lvl PvP Staff has has 1201 SP and T2 60 lvl PvP Staff has 1393 SP. So that is a 192 SP difference which is only 16 % more. So by getting to rank 80 you gain a relatively small boost to SP.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clasbyte View Post
    You guys checked the pvp equipment?

    First set is Rank free Level 60 for just favor, then there is an Rank 60 Armor and an Upgrade of that one so we have an reset with the rank free armor. Problem solved.

    brgds

    CB
    That just means new people would go: Level up 1-60, buy level 60 gear set.

    Stop. Double-take. Realize that they need to grind up 60 ranks to get the next set.

  4. #24
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    I absolutely disagree with resets. Although I had fun leveling to r50, it was also a grind and since I didn't cash in on the conquest mess, it took me time to get there. I don't want this wiped as if it never happened. I can't imagine having to do it all over again just to make a newcomer feel "ok" about starting at the beginning. Keep the ranks where they are please, thank you.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virulent View Post
    Quit asking for resets.

    Sick of people with poor suggestions like this.
    I know right.

    It just boggles the mind to think people could come up with an idea like this.

    I dunno, maybe we should all start at level 1 with blue gear again too. Or maybe we should all wipe our crafting skills to 0 as well. How about all that great raid gear? I mean, we wouldn't want the newcomers to feel frustrated when they compare themselves to us, would we?

    Sheesh, come on you guys. Scary part is, is that Trion might just listen to these people.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Tobby View Post
    Do people not understand that there are PvP rank BG's I just got done leveling from 1-50 and pre rank 40 i did not see a lot of rank 50's. If there are an influx of new people or returning people they will be put up against same rank people.
    I wish there were, because it would render this problem largely irrelevant.

    I've been leveling a warrior alt from rank 1 - 15 recently, and she has always had r50s against her. Not even a single time has she not. She even gets put in r39-50 warfronts frequently while solo queuing. The system does not work. It's just a one-sided faceroll and not enjoyable in the slightest.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzi View Post
    I know right.

    It just boggles the mind to think people could come up with an idea like this.

    I dunno, maybe we should all start at level 1 with blue gear again too. Or maybe we should all wipe our crafting skills to 0 as well. How about all that great raid gear? I mean, we wouldn't want the newcomers to feel frustrated when they compare themselves to us, would we?

    Sheesh, come on you guys. Scary part is, is that Trion might just listen to these people.
    Wait, do you seriously think raid gear from pre-SL is still going to be useful at level 60?

  8. #28
    Disagree 100%

    I do support the idea that new players should get a nominal prestige gain while leveling up to take the edge off, a rank reset is pointless. Is everyone somehow missing the fact that warfronts are already bracketed? It is not as if new players are going to get steamrolled by rank 80 players in every warfront for months the same way many of the current R50 players did back when it was 6/8 ranks and you went into a level 50 warfront against max rank players to get your face smashed in.

    As with everything, leveling up, ranking up, gearing up, are all learning opportunities, getting that first level 60 set to play with will bracket the new players against mostly other new players in the same boat and this is where they cut their teeth. The rank up was where you had very little mitigation so you played with specs and styles and died a lot until you found something that worked and got better at it.

    I suppose you could akin ranking up to skill ups, because your learning the entire time. A rank reset would do nothing but serve to slap everyone else in the face who got max rank already.

    To give a little perspective, in one of WoW's expansions(I forget which one, could be all of them) within 1 level up I replaced engame raid epics with quest greens(I think burning crusade). I and many others were pretty pissed off, our gear didn't even survive the first quest HUB (Not zone, HUB).

    Now on the subject of new players, yes, expansions DO offer new content for new players, specifically 4 new souls to level with, changes to game mechanics, the ability to learn specs that are totally revamped and strange to veteran players while they level, and a promise of some wicked endgame content and oldworld raids to tinker with. Sorry to get a little off topic here but grats if you read the whole thing.

    /endwalloftext

  9. #29
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    If the ranks stay the same all we are going to see are the people at r50 now getting to r70 within x amount of time and blowing up the new people then complain when people stop doing pvp again. Putting everyone on the same playing field with new specs, the same gear etc will make things more enjoyable.
    Misterx R43 Mage

  10. #30
    I don't think a rank reset is necessary IF a good, stable and working bracket system is made for the lvl 60 bracket pvp so that max ranked players are facing off vs beginners. If this bracketed system is not made to standard then the next best choice is to do a full reset otherwise Rift WILL run into the exact same issues as before.

  11. #31
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    I think a lot of people are missing the point of a rank reset. It is not to punish players who grinded out rank 50 or make it easymode for new people who come into the game. The point is to breath new life into this game because the pvp community is dying, more rapidly than one might want to believe.

    I understand many people want to be selfish, but you need to look at this from a large scale perspective about what is best for pvp as a whole. Right now we have 50 ranks and most of the time we are in unranked WFs with low ranks getting absolutely destroyed. Add in an additional 30 ranks and this magnifies this issue even further. This game does not have the pvp population to support this bracketed type of pvp. If it did trust me I would not care about a rank reset. As it stands now having 80 ranks is going to make this small pvp community even more uneven.

    The only way to replenish the dwindling population is to bring more people in. The easiest way to do this is to have a rank reset. I understand many of you do not like this idea and think you earned you rank 50 by working hard, but please try to think about the longevity of pvp and breathing new life into it.

    If we continue on this path Rift will always be a PvP grind fest to get to the next rank and never give the endgame pvp many of us have hoped for. The more ranks we add the further is it pushing away new players from entering into PvP and rejuvenating the population. PvP should never be just about grinding ranks, but currently that is all it is. So please Trion give the community a chance to flourish and grow instead of pushing new players away creating a larger gap (further killing Pvp in this game.)

  12. #32
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    How can you all NOT see that Rift is "a gear and level PROGRESSION based game!"

    Because of the underlying game model, it applies to PvE **and** PvP!

    All the players that play Everquest/WoW/Rift/etc, play it *because* it's progressive and it's the progression that keep the players playing it. If you remove the progression, you'll lose those players that are already here and like the game the way it is. You can't split progression from PvP and keep it for PvE or you'll completely split the player base where 4/5ths of your player base will only play PvE and the other 1/5th will only play PvP.

    Gear progression is the name of the game. Even if you remove the ranking systems, it's still progressive, you have to have the previous pieces to get the next piece. They keep the Prestige Ranks as a goal for incentive to progress... as in PROGRESSION.

    Those of you that want to remove progression from Rift, utterly fail to see the whole point of the game... go play Halo, you don't have to level up in that game.

    As for endgame PvP... Rank up to max rank! You now have your endgame PvP.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhrawn View Post
    How can you all NOT see that Rift is "a gear and level PROGRESSION based game!"

    Because of the underlying game model, it applies to PvE **and** PvP!

    All the players that play Everquest/WoW/Rift/etc, play it *because* it's progressive and it's the progression that keep the players playing it. If you remove the progression, you'll lose those players that are already here and like the game the way it is. You can't split progression from PvP and keep it for PvE or you'll completely split the player base where 4/5ths of your player base will only play PvE and the other 1/5th will only play PvP.

    Gear progression is the name of the game. Even if you remove the ranking systems, it's still progressive, you have to have the previous pieces to get the next piece. They keep the Prestige Ranks as a goal for incentive to progress... as in PROGRESSION.

    Those of you that want to remove progression from Rift, utterly fail to see the whole point of the game... go play Halo, you don't have to level up in that game.

    As for endgame PvP... Rank up to max rank! You now have your endgame PvP.
    You completely misread my post which honestly isn't a surprise. At no point did I ever say remove progression from Pvp. I did not say remove the 30 new ranks Trion wishes to implement. You are not going to lose out on content.

    You do understand that all PvE progression that has currently happen is being reset? All the awesome ID gear and HK gear is going to obsolete. Every PvEr is starting from scratch again and going to have to raid to get good gear again. This expansion is a GEAR RESET. A new player can come into this expansion and be on the same playing field that every high end raider is at level 60. There should be no reason this is not the case for PvP.

    I honestly just cannot even understand why people are so scared of being on an even playing field. You would think pvpers would want an influx of players so they have more people to play. Please understand a gear reset does not mean no more progression! Thanks

  14. #34
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    So players should progress rank 1-60 to get access to lvl 60 gear. 60 ranks to get any useable gear?

    Any decent players(those are few and far between) I've spoken with want a reset for the reasons Fates has given.

    Pvp will die even more so in the game if there isn't fresh blood. I hit Rank 6 on my cleric in April 2011, Rank 6 on my mage in June of 2011. I do not care if I need to re-earn ranks and I start at the same place as new players as opposed to continuing to progress from where I started a year and a half ago.

    PVE players will need to restart playing new dungeons for new gear, the grind for them starts again. They won't be raiding in ID raid gear.

  15. #35
    I'd really just like to see Prestige gained from 10 onwards.

    But there is definitely an issue.

    Currently as a PvPer, you cannot get to lvl 60 then start working your way through gear without doing it the slow way of going through all the Prestige ranks and all the previous gear.

    In PvE, like others have stated, you get to lvl 60 then work on gearing up - all of the previous gear means nothing. It doesn't matter that you didn't do lvl 50 dungeons or any raids, you start fresh.

    That is a definite disparity between the two playstyles.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Fates View Post
    You completely misread my post which honestly isn't a surprise. At no point did I ever say remove progression from Pvp. I did not say remove the 30 new ranks Trion wishes to implement. You are not going to lose out on content.

    You do understand that all PvE progression that has currently happen is being reset? All the awesome ID gear and HK gear is going to obsolete. Every PvEr is starting from scratch again and going to have to raid to get good gear again. This expansion is a GEAR RESET. A new player can come into this expansion and be on the same playing field that every high end raider is at level 60. There should be no reason this is not the case for PvP.

    I honestly just cannot even understand why people are so scared of being on an even playing field. You would think pvpers would want an influx of players so they have more people to play. Please understand a gear reset does not mean no more progression! Thanks
    I don't think Brawn was talking about your post, because there was a few who mentioned fair, even ground pvp and most can assume they are talking about normalized pvp. I fully get your post, and honestly I'll play either way but I can see why people who already got to R50 do not want to start from scratch again. I think it will be more important to not have HUGE disparity between ranks like upper tiered players facing off vs lower tiered to a GOOD bracket system should be made to enssure a more pleasant experience with far less stress and a lot less two shottings.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fates View Post
    You completely misread my post which honestly isn't a surprise. At no point did I ever say remove progression from Pvp. I did not say remove the 30 new ranks Trion wishes to implement. You are not going to lose out on content.

    You do understand that all PvE progression that has currently happen is being reset? All the awesome ID gear and HK gear is going to obsolete. Every PvEr is starting from scratch again and going to have to raid to get good gear again. This expansion is a GEAR RESET. A new player can come into this expansion and be on the same playing field that every high end raider is at level 60. There should be no reason this is not the case for PvP.

    I honestly just cannot even understand why people are so scared of being on an even playing field. You would think pvpers would want an influx of players so they have more people to play. Please understand a gear reset does not mean no more progression! Thanks
    I did read what you said, and Keeping PvP Prestige ranks is no different than keeping leveling from 1-60 in relation to endgame raiding.

    Saying you want to reset Prestige ranks is pretty much the same as a PvE raider saying, "Remove leveling through 60 and just start us out at level 60 so we can start gearing up for endgame raiding as soon as we start playing."

    For PvEers, first you have to level up, then you have to gear up. Resetting Prestige for PvP is like saying, forget leveling up, just gear up. This is in complete contrary to the style of game Rift is!

    I understand exactly what you're saying, you want a reset so everyone (mainly newcomers) can start on the same level. Now explain to me how that's as fair as removing the leveling requirement from 1-60 so those same players can start on the same level as endgame raiders!?

    If that happens, you've just dumbed down Rift by a power of 2.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosh View Post
    They won't be raiding in ID raid gear.
    New players will also have to level up through 1-60 before they start getting new level 60 gear.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhrawn View Post
    I did read what you said, and Keeping PvP Prestige ranks is no different than keeping leveling from 1-60 in relation to endgame raiding.

    Saying you want to reset Prestige ranks is pretty much the same as a PvE raider saying, "Remove leveling through 60 and just start us out at level 60 so we can start gearing up for endgame raiding as soon as we start playing."

    For PvEers, first you have to level up, then you have to gear up. Resetting Prestige for PvP is like saying, forget leveling up, just gear up. This is in complete contrary to the style of game Rift is!

    I understand exactly what you're saying, you want a reset so everyone (mainly newcomers) can start on the same level. Now explain to me how that's as fair as removing the leveling requirement from 1-60 so those same players can start on the same level as endgame raiders!?

    If that happens, you've just dumbed down Rift by a power of 2.
    Lol what? You do realize you have to level to 60 for PvP also? If you are going to try to combat my statement could you provide reasons why resetting the ranks would be bad for pvp as a whole (not just the individual player.) If they reset the PvP ranks it would be exactly like how raiding will be in SL. Every player (new and old) will have to level to 60 then begin the grind from the beginning with no advantage over new players. All I am trying to do is revitalize the PvP community and bring in fresh blood, not punish the vets.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fates View Post
    Lol what? You do realize you have to level to 60 for PvP also? If you are going to try to combat my statement could you provide reasons why resetting the ranks would be bad for pvp as a whole (not just the individual player.) If they reset the PvP ranks it would be exactly like how raiding will be in SL. Every player (new and old) will have to level to 60 then begin the grind from the beginning with no advantage over new players. All I am trying to do is revitalize the PvP community and bring in fresh blood, not punish the vets.
    For PvE, old players will not have to level from 1-50 over again. They'll start at 50 and work up to 60. New players will have to start at 1 and level to 60.

    In PvP, old players will not have to rank from 1-50 over again. They'll start at 50 and work up to 80. New players will have to start at Rank 1 and Rank up to 80.

    How do you not see how PvP and PvE work the same. Removing the grind from 1-50 in PvP would be like removing the grind from level 1-50 in PvE.

    Now, I KNOW that you're going to say, "But PvP can't start Ranking until they hit level 50!"

    It doesn't matter. PvE is not 'resetting' anything. It's EXPANDING! PvP shouldn't 'reset' anything either... it's EXPANDING!

    At Level 60, they don't have to have ANY RANK to get the base Level 60 PvP gear, so it's not like they'll be at a disadvantage, they'll just have to make up the pretige grind like ALL the R50's have already done. In MMO's you dont' remove content when expansions come out, you add to it. Same goes for PvP. You don't remove ranking up with expansions, you add to it.

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